Are rim brakes as good as disc brakes?

[ichitan]

In the old days, bikes had rim brakes. They worked well, and we were happy with them.

Then one day, bikes came out with disc brakes. Then we realized, disc brakes had more stopping power than rim brakes. So if you wanted a good bike, it needed to have disc brakes.

Except:

When I come across decent bikes being trashed, I rescue them. Several years ago, I picked up a bike from the trash. It was covered in dust. I took it home, and cleaned it up. It is a 26 inch mountain bike, without suspension. My guess is that it was likely to have been made in the late 1980s or early 1990s. It seems this bike was bought, and almost never ridden. But just put in a room. It has probably never been in the rain. Then several years ago, it was thrown in the trash. I had picked up a bike around 30 years old, in new condition.

I put air in the tires, and rode the bike. This bike has rim brakes, with very little wear, and they work really well. The stopping power is as good as many disc brakes.

Then I realized, leading up to, and during the release of early disc brake bikes, brake pads for rim brakes were made from harder and harder rubber, until they had poor stopping power. Because it happened gradually, we didn't notice. I believe this is one of the dirty tricks the bike industry played on customers, so that a lot of people would go out and buy bikes with disc brakes.

Tour de France bikes have had rim brakes until very recently. So they work well.

I believe, if the brake pads on your rim brake bike wear out, and you glue strips of rubber from truck tires to them, they will work well.

The main downside of rime brakes is if the wheel goes out of true. Rim brakes then need to be adjusted to have a large gap, so a large range of movement is needed on the brake lever.

People say water on the rim is a problem. When applied, the brakes quickly remove water. For casual cyclists, water is not normally a problem. For people in competition, and people pushing bikes to near their limit, it might be.

[ReapThaWhirlwind]

Rim brakes can be dangerously powerful. Back when I was a kid, they were so strong, you had to be careful not to jam on them because you could fly over the handlebars.

Disc brakes offer better modulation and versatility in all weather conditions.

So what you're looking at as "best" is braking power vs versatility.

[meamoantonio]

(08-07-2023, 06:02 PM)ReapThaWhirlwind Wrote:  Rim brakes can be dangerously powerful. Back when I was a kid, they were so strong, you had to be careful not to jam on them because you could fly over the handlebars.

Disc brakes offer better modulation and versatility in all weather conditions.

So what you're looking at as "best" is braking power vs versatility.

It really depends on how you ride and where you ride for example

Mountain Bikers that tackle alot of descents and will need to modulate alot, I'd go disc for sure, you'll need all the bells and whistles that come along with it like heat dissipation, a more sure way to control modulation, and overall reliability regardless of weather conditions since trails can sometimes be wet and wild

Road bikers on the other hand need different things, if I want something light for climbing, i'd probably go for rim brakes but if the descents are crazy with double digit negative gradients, i'd probably go for disc again. If you live in a generally flat area rim brakes would also be a great choice since it's lighter and can be more aero versus disc brakes

[enkei]

Depends what you need. I love the power and control of hydraulic disc brakes, especially in wet/muddy conditions.

However, both of my road bikes and my single-speed are rim-brake. With quality components and brake pads, my rim brakes provide all the stopping power I need, even in the rain. (This might simply be exposing how little high-speed cycling i do, especially in the rain, LOL)

By the way, if you need good rim brake pads for wet weather, SwissStop are legendary. I run BXP with alloy rims.

A simple breakdown of the pros/cons:

Rim Brakes

Pros:

• lighter
• cheaper to buy
• cheaper to maintain
• easier to setup and service (with one caveat - see cons below)
• no risk from pulling the brake lever with the wheel removed
  

Cons:

• less ultimate stopping power than good discs
• less control/modulation than good discs
• wear out the rim (consider the cost of new rims/wheels versus regular discs/pads)
• use of carbon wheels can be questionable with rim brakes (see next point about alpine descents)
• can't use TPU inner tubes if you do a lot of alpine descents (because of the high temps generated by braking)
• it's getting harder and harder to find nice new wheels for rim-brake bikes
• it's getting harder and harder to find nice new rim-brake groupsets
  

Disc Brakes

Pros:

• supreme mix of stopping power and control
• far superior to rim brakes if you do a lot of high-speed/downhill braking
• generally superior to rim brakes in very wet/muddy conditions
• hydraulic disc brakes generally don't need as much regular attention as rim brakes
• wheels last much longer (no brake tracks to wear out)
• easier to find new wheels for disc-brake bikes
  

Cons:

• heavy compared to rim brakes
• expensive compared to rim brakes
• worse aero
• can be noisy
• disc wheel lacing patterns can limit aesthetic choices
• servicing/maintenance is a much bigger faff than rim brakes
• cheaper mechanical disc brakes generally suck Bronto balls
• cable hydraulic disc brakes can require constant attention
• removing/fitting wheels can be a bit more faff than with rim brakes, especially if didn't use a spacer...
  

[ichitan]

If you hit a large rock, you may get a pinch flat. You may also kink the rim, particularly if it is aluminum. If you have a kink in a rim, rim brakes will not have even braking force when they come to the kink.

[enkei]

(08-08-2023, 11:39 PM)ichitan Wrote:  If you hit a large rock, you may get a pinch flat. You may also kink the rim, particularly if it is aluminum. If you have a kink in a rim, rim brakes will not have even braking force when they come to the kink.

Great point!

[GirishH]

Really wonderful discussion, ichitan. i swore by rim brakes because they are so simple and manageable easily. I had them when I did long distance bike-packing trips and even during RAGBRAI. I did hear the water/rain making them less safe but so many other things make biking unsafe in rain, I was/am ok with my rim brakes.

Then I tried disc brakes during a week-long bike ride on the Great Divide Mountain Bike Route where there was a lot of elevation gain or loss. There the rental Trek gravel bike came with disc brakes and was so happy for that. I remember I had to stop during a couple of steep descents because I could burning smell. This gave me time to appreciate the beautiful mountains around me as I let the brakes cool down a bit. Surely, rim brakes would not have given me the precise stopping that these disc brakes provided.

The fat bike I rode in South America too came with disc brakes and was glad it did. Some of the routes we rode there were steep when you would go from 15,000 ft to 11,000 or so within a couple of hours. There I was glad to have disc brakes even though they did heat up enough times that I had to stop and let them cool down. On a particularly steep descent in Colombia, I had no braking power. This is as we were trying to get out of the mountains before sundown and no guard rails to save us from a fall. So, I had to stop to adjust the brakes and let them cool down. But, am sure the rim brakes would have just melted away.

Like enkei lists, rim brakes are definitely inexpensive and have widespread application. I still like them for their simplicity..