Restoring 1970s Raleigh Grand Prix

[bullfrog64]

just started project on Ladies Model - everything pretty much original and in decent shape, need advice on a) moving column shifters to bar location, and b) increasing rear cassette (5) to a triple - what brands can I use? Any comments will be helpful

[nfmisso]

First layout a complete plan of what you are trying to accomplish. It sounds like a refurb/update project, not a restoration. What is your budget? And pictures are required.

I believe that the GP came with stem mounted shifters. Do you want shifters integrated with the brake levers (aka brifters), or at the bar ends (bar cons)?

Your bike currently has a freewheel, not a cassette. To go with a cassette will require a new rear wheel - AND cold setting of the frame. You may be able to get a 130mm OLD hub in there without cold setting, but I doubt it. The frame is 2030 steel, which can be cold set, but is a bit stiff for opening up 5mm on spring action.

Use this: http://sheldonbrown.com/retroraleighs/grand-prix.html to help you get a better idea of what year GP you have.

Where and how are you going to be riding it? Flat lands, hills, etc. How far? How much weight will the bike be carrying (you plus all the gear you will take along)?

I would change the brakes to Tektro dual pivot side pulls; the rims to ISO 622 Velocity Dyads, Wheelsmith spokes, New tires, tubes, and
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Tourney-ST-A070-7-Speed-Lever/dp/B00GQCC9A0/
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Tourney-30x39x50t-Crankset-Cjhainguard/dp/B00C45E9YW/
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Tourney-7-Speed-Front-Derailleur/dp/B00C45HXBS/
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-Square-Bottom-Bracket-68x113mm/dp/B005DTIKQE/
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-RD-M390-Acera-Rear-Derailleur/dp/B007FP71SM/
- might need a hanger for your application
http://www.amazon.com/Velo-Orange-Grand-Cru-Touring/dp/B005XGAP38/
http://www.amazon.com/Velo-Orange-Grand-Cru-Flange/dp/B005V7NA0Y/
http://www.amazon.com/Velocity-Dyad-Rim-700c-Silver/dp/B001GSKR08/
http://www.amazon.com/Velocity-Dyad-Rim-700c-Silver/dp/B001GSQSG0/

Of course, before doing all of the above; I would get a lugged double butted 531 or Cro-Mo frame...

[cny-man]

A Grand Prix is not a good choice for such an extensive upgrade. You are looking at a very large investment of both time and money. Would be much, much better to pay $200-$250 (the amount you would be paying minimum to upgrade to cassette wheels and a triple plus shifters and derailleurs) for a bike that is better in the first place.

p.s. Nigel is doing it with a wry sense of humor, but is saying essentially the same thing, as the Raleigh does not have a high quality frame at all.

[nfmisso]

(04-28-2014, 02:21 PM)cny-man Wrote:  .......

p.s. Nigel is doing it with a wry sense of humor, but is saying essentially the same thing, as the Raleigh does not have a high quality frame at all.

And it was supposed to be a secret

[bullfrog64]

I've identified the frame as late 1969 female Grand Prix. The bike is for my GF, not for me. I have new tires coming, and will strip&paint frame (metallic blue Oldsmobile colour), perhaps buy decals, maybe pedals&cages, and add new HB tape. Bike, tires, and gadgets will total about $150.00.
I've bought Shimano bar shifters - cheap and simple, provided I can find a way to route the cables off the downtube - have found used Simplex guide but still have to get the cables to the bars. So that's what I need help with at the moment. Everything works fine and I dont plan to change the freewheel or the derailleurs; the Steel rims are in very good shape. English Raleigh 20-30 quality of the period was decent, I rode a GP for years and a Competition, but I dont disagree with your comments.

Personally I ride a Kestrel 200C. Terrain in Gulf Coast Florida is flat with some bridges and rolling hills.
Am grateful for your comments and your prompt reply, thanks much.
David

---

You guys are just SO smart.

[cny-man]

Bar shifters?? Do you mean thumb shifters? Bad - make that terrible idea, as are the suicide levers. Even stem shifters are a poor substitute for down tube levers.

Again, your project does not make sense given the cost of a better used bike that would be essentially ready to ride. I'm assuming the seat height is for you or the previous owner, not your GF - sure hope so.

[bullfrog64]

These are flat Shimano thumb shifters, not the ones that stand up. Anyway I've never heard of anyone going over the bars and impaling themselves on shifters.
Down tube shifters are fine, but some ladies are not comfortable with them. And if I decide not to move the shifters, no big deal. The best of course are the integrated shifter and brake controls.
And..guess what...the seat post moves up and down...
thanks

(05-02-2014, 02:32 PM)cny-man Wrote:  Bar shifters?? Do you mean thumb shifters? Bad - make that terrible idea, as are the suicide levers. Even stem shifters are a poor substitute for down tube levers.

Again, your project does not make sense given the cost of a better used bike that would be essentially ready to ride. I'm assuming the seat height is for you or the previous owner, not your GF - sure hope so.

[cny-man]

(05-02-2014, 04:02 PM)bullfrog64 Wrote:  These are flat Shimano thumb shifters, not the ones that stand up. Anyway I've never heard of anyone going over the bars and impaling themselves on shifters.
Down tube shifters are fine, but some ladies are not comfortable with them. And if I decide not to move the shifters, no big deal. The best of course are the integrated shifter and brake controls.
And..guess what...the seat post moves up and down...
thanks

(05-02-2014, 02:32 PM)cny-man Wrote:  Bar shifters?? Do you mean thumb shifters? Bad - make that terrible idea, as are the suicide levers. Even stem shifters are a poor substitute for down tube levers.

Again, your project does not make sense given the cost of a better used bike that would be essentially ready to ride. I'm assuming the seat height is for you or the previous owner, not your GF - sure hope so.

Thumb shifters and suicide levers mean the rider's hand are wrapped around the bar at a point where there is less steering leverage and less ability to hold onto the bars in a collision. The suicide levers also are useless in an emergency situation, especially with steel rims. The issue is not what one hits when going over the bars but that it is so easy to do so.

You would be wiser to resell the bike and get a nice, aluminum rim equipped hybrid. Unless your GF is going to be wearing dresses on the bike there's no reason to limit her choice to a women's/open frame.

I'm aware the seat post moves, was natural to wonder about it given some of your other decisions.

[nfmisso]

For your GF's safety; replace the rims with aluminum rims and at get some Kool Stop Salmon brake pads.

If you really value her life, you will sway the brakes for some dual pivot side pulls, loose the suicide levers and current brake levers, replace the brake levers with aero ones and cross-levers.

[cny-man]

You asked for advice, said any comments would be helpful. If you just want to do whatever you're not looking for advice but rather affirmation. That's not my gig - I give honest, informed opinions, without couching. I assume people have the strength to hear the truth.

[1FJEF]

(05-02-2014, 02:26 PM)bullfrog64 Wrote:  I've bought Shimano bar shifters - cheap and simple, provided I can find a way to route the cables off the downtube - have found used Simplex guide but still have to get the cables to the bars. So that's what I need help with at the moment.

You need cable stops for the downtube shifter area. You remove the shifters and one of a few styles of stops will fit there.
1) Please post better pics of the downtube shifter area.
2) Please show exactly which new shifters you got.
3) Does she ride with her hands up top?
4) Does the bike stop OK but not great at the speeds you ride or is it a death trap?

[bullfrog64]

Here are pics of the Shimano shifters and the Simplex cable guide.
She currently rides a nice Trek hybrid and used to ride long distances but now wants a ladies' style because of low back disc problem which is why she prefers to ride upright.

The brakes are Weimann center pull ones, and are solid. The pads are fine and stop well on the steel rims. As an upright rider she does not ride really fast and it's a test of patience when she rides with me, so I favor the Raleigh GP which is lighter than the Trek. We also have a dedicated paved riding trail here.

[cny-man]

The info you just provided about her needs and limitations would have helped greatly at the outset. I'm sorry to hear of her problems, and is kind of you to help her. Sometimes context is everything. I only see one pic, but I believe you are referring to stem shifters.

[bullfrog64]

pic of shifters attached, sorry but I dont think I can upload more than one pic per email.
you are up early. I used to get up early when I lived in the desert, but mainly so I would be awake before the snakes.

[cny-man]

I would suggest looking for a junker bike with upright bars and decent brake levers/cables and switch over. Going to be precious little room left for hands if you mount thoarse shift levers on a downturn bar. Trick is to find a bar with diameter compatible with your present stem.

[1FJEF]

Great news on the brakes.
I need a side view of your simplex piece. I can't tell if it's a cable stop or guide or what. If I remember correctly a modern set of stops is under $20. If price is an issue you can get a full set of all cables for $8 from walmart.

I have experience with the ride position. First I suggest you change the handlebars. The brake levers too. Both items are cheap, I may have a set of spare 2" rise MTB bars. The drop bars should go. For an even more upright position I suggest cruiser bars. I have a chart somewhere that will show you how much rise & "back" towards the rider you get with different models.

[bullfrog64]

thanks for the input from N.Mexico....am holding off changing shifter locations for the moment.....I have bought new Jagwire cables...but I may be interested in your MTB handlebars, can you send a pic? By the way, the Simplex piece is a guide, 2 tracks, clamps on the downtube.
There is a nice set of Italian drop bars on ebay with brakes and shifters already on them, tempting but I'm not sure if I have the expertise to carry it off right.