Campagnolo Rear Axle

[stixmaster1]

I'm doing an overhaul on a bike.

The cones are pretty shot I reckon. I need one of the following fixes:

1. New Cones for front + rear axle
2. Full new axle (front and rear)
3. A way to "repair" the current cones on the axles.

I've googled this a lot and not had much joy but maybe I'm looking in the wrong places or maybe you have found an excellent supplier.

So far I've spent under £100 on drive train and brakes. (bargain hunting gone well) so I'm REALLY not up for spending more than about £20 TOPS on this. I live in the UK and found a few excellent options like this:

before realising that the shipping was £30.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AXLE-CONES-REAR-Campagnolo-Nuovo-Super-Record-10mm-x-26tpi-2-Sets-NEW-/360469578375?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53eda94287#ht_1566wt_845


I only need cones that fit the wheel that is to say 10mm diameter 26TPI and for use with 1/4" bearings on the back and 7/32" bearings on the front.

by the way WHY WOULD PICK 7/32" BEARINGS CAMPAG!

I'm not set on getting campy cones (would settle for other if cheaper and easier to get) but I would need to know, for certain, that they were actually going to fit right. I have shiny new bearing so I just need the cone. The reason I mention a whole new axle is because that might be cheaper. If a new axle presents it's self then it need to be compatible with the original 8sp Freehub that's on the wheel at the moment. This thing:
http://branfordbike.com/articles/cassettes-and-cogs-pg60.htm

ideas?

EDIT: What happens if you put an entirely new axle on the thing. Can I do it? Would the bearing size change? What options do I have of making these wheels run true without buying an entirely new wheel or changing the freehub.

[Joe_W]

A new axle again means that you need cones that resemble your original ones unless you can get the cups out of the hub body. I do not know how tight the tolerances are for cup and cone bearings, but I probably wouldn't want to try this. How good are the cups? I'd expect some wear on those, too, if the cones are shot. You might need to replace them... which you actually cannot (well, without a lot of effort).

The best bet is indeed a new rear hub (and rebuilding the wheel) or a new rear wheel. Or maybe a used rear wheel from a parts bin at the local bike shop. This is probably the option that will require the least amount of money. However, the wheel probably needs to be trued and stress relieved...

Edit: this is of course if you cannot find any replacement cones

[stixmaster1]

(07-11-2012, 10:16 AM)Joe_W Wrote:  A new axle again means that you need cones that resemble your original ones unless you can get the cups out of the hub body. I do not know how tight the tolerances are for cup and cone bearings, but I probably wouldn't want to try this. How good are the cups? I'd expect some wear on those, too, if the cones are shot. You might need to replace them... which you actually cannot (well, without a lot of effort).

The best bet is indeed a new rear hub (and rebuilding the wheel) or a new rear wheel. Or maybe a used rear wheel from a parts bin at the local bike shop. This is probably the option that will require the least amount of money. However, the wheel probably needs to be trued and stress relieved...

Hi Joe,
You seem to be my go-to man at the moment. I'd like to clarify some terms that I've used to avoid confusion.

On the wheel there is the QR spoke which removed initially and has no part in this.
The is the threaded axle in the centre of the wheel. 10mm Diameter on my bike.
Onto the threaded axle there are axle cones, spacers and lock-nuts. When I have referred to "cones" I'm talking about the axle cones that thread onto the axle (10 26TPI in this case.
The "hub" refers to the entirety of the metal casing that the spokes go into and contains the axle.
The hub has inside "hub-cups" which is where ball bearings contact the hub.
The bearings (steel ball bearings) rest in the "hub-cup" of the wheel and are what the cones (axle cones) fit to when tightening up the whole thing.

ok some how much of the above is correct then?! That's how I've been using terms so far please do correct my mistakes!

Why would I need the new cones to resemble the old ones? I assume that the size of ball bearing used is determined by the cups in the hubs. Does that mean that I need a size of cone that will fit with those bearings then? The rear-wheel has 1/4" bearings which seem to be standard right? Will it be easy to find cones that size?

[Joe_W]

(07-11-2012, 10:34 AM)stixmaster1 Wrote:  Hi Joe,
You seem to be my go-to man at the moment. I'd like to clarify some terms that I've used to avoid confusion.

On the wheel there is the QR spoke which removed initially and has no part in this.

QR skewer, spokes are the thingies that hold the rim to the hub body

Quote:The is the threaded axle in the centre of the wheel. 10mm Diameter on my bike.
Onto the threaded axle there are axle cones, spacers and lock-nuts.

I'd call those bearing cones, cause they are primariliy parts of the cup and cone bearing

Quote: When I have referred to "cones" I'm talking about the axle cones that thread onto the axle (10 26TPI in this case.
The "hub" refers to the entirety of the metal casing that the spokes go into and contains the axle.
The hub has inside "hub-cups" which is where ball bearings contact the hub.
The bearings (steel ball bearings) rest in the "hub-cup" of the wheel and are what the cones (axle cones) fit to when tightening up the whole thing.

again, I'd probably say bearing cups... but on the other hand I'm not a native speaker (and I do understand what you're talking about), so I guess all is ok

Quote:Why would I need the new cones to resemble the old ones? I assume that the size of ball bearing used is determined by the cups in the hubs. Does that mean that I need a size of cone that will fit with those bearings then? The rear-wheel has 1/4" bearings which seem to be standard right? Will it be easy to find cones that size?

A cup and cone bearing consists of two parts: the cup and the cone (oh, and the bearing balls). These parts were designed together (well, the balls are round and a specific size, so not much design going on there). Thus the cup and the cone fit together (with the correct size and number of bearing balls). You might be able to swap out cones for a (slightly) different kind, but I am not a mechanical engineer. When the US guys wake up there's probably some that can comment on that. So: In principle you will be able to replace the bearing cones. The correct ones are difficult to find because they differ from manufacturer to manufacturer and from year to year (probably...). Plus, there's the problem that the thread has to be correct. Oh, and the bearing cups should be in good condition, too, otherwise you would have to replace them too and they are pressed into the hub which complicates matters.

[stixmaster1]

Hmm, yeah looks like the bearing cups are a bit shanked too which is a slight issue. Maybe this whole thing is a wild goose chase. On the other hand it would be good to know on principle!

Correct threading isn't TOO bad, 26TPI is what I have and seems common. especially on campy axles.

[nfmisso]

I am a Mechanical Engineer....

Joe is correct that the cups, cones and balls are part of a system that has to match, or at least be really close.

Cost wise, the cheapest solution is a new set of wheels; less expensive wheels need their spokes tensioned and stress relieved, and once that is done, they'll last as long, or longer than more expensive wheels; rim and wheel pricing is somewhat inversely proportional to mass - lower mass is more expensive.

Also; make sure you understand O.L.D.

http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_n-o.html#old
http://sheldonbrown.com/upgrade.html

[Joe_W]

Nigel you are just the guy I was thinking of

If money was an issue I'd put the original wheel back together and try to use it as is for the time (until the bearings are really shot, it's a miracle what you can get away with) or drop by at a local bike shop and ask there about a used wheel. The last rear wheel I got was... 10-15 EUR (12-18 USD) I think, though it's hard to tell as I also got some new tyres and tubes and stuff. I had to true and tension it, if you have this done expect to pay another 20-30 bucks I guess.

Save the money to get a decent pair of no-nonsense wheels next season: mid-range cup-and-cone bearing hubs (eg. Shimano Tiagra, you can and should overhaul them frequently in contrast to "industrial" bearings), 32 spokes laced cross 3, eg. Mavic CXP rims (low to mid range, the really cheap stuff is not inexpensive but cheap). Some shops offer custom built wheels that are quite competitively priced (just getting the parts would be more expensive for you). Or maybe get a last-or-even-year-before entry level wheelset. Mavic Aksium are decent enough though you have to overhaul the freehub body once a year with the older (2007?) ones, the bearings are industrial bearings and cannot be overhauled, though.

[DaveM]

(07-11-2012, 12:03 PM)nfmisso Wrote:  Joe is correct that the cups, cones and balls are part of a system that has to match, or at least be really close.

You are of course generally correct. But I will say that I've seen a lot of people mix cones from different wheels without a big problem. As long as they're made for 1/4" bearings they will roll fine. The biggest issue I've run in to is that if the diameter of the new cones is not very close to the old ones you may have a large gap between the cones and the dust cover on the hub that lets in debris. Or worse, if too big, the cone will rub on the dust cover.

But you could probably buy an axle set with all the cones, spacers, and locknuts on it for less than a set of campy cones and then the threading issue doesn't matter. Not ideal, but it will work.
That said, if the cups are shot (cracks/pits), just get a new wheel.

[rayms]

Are there any 10 x 1 cones that will work in this hub shell. I got a 10 X 1 x 141 mm titanium axle so I can run a wider freewheel.
Shimano CN-R001(◾Fits older Ultegra and Sante FH-6402 & FH6401) is 16.8mm in diameter. My only concern is the taper of the Shimano cone is less, causing the ball bearings to ride lower on the cone than on the original Campi cone.