Strange cassette issue

[Dalton2250]

Hey guys,

Bit of a weird one for you.

I recently attempted to tighten my Sram 9spd cassette because it was rattling and appeared loose.

So I got my cassette tool & adjustable wrench to do the job, then thought hmmm, while I'm here I'll try to get it off without a chainwhip, see if I can. To my surprise, whilst holding the cassette with a rag I managed to remove the cassette.

However, there did not appear to be a freehub underneath it! All that was there was the end of the hub, with the springs/pawls on. I think the freehub may have got stuck inside the cassette and come off with it.

Anyway, I took the axle out, gave it a clean, greased the threaded ends & put it back in. I then slotted the cassette back on & there were these nuts at each end of the axle that needed putting back on. So I put these on, to find that if I tightened them to anything more than snug with my fingers the cassette wouldn't actually spin round! Does anyone know what these nuts are?

I then put the cassette tool back in & tried to re-tighten the cassette with the adjustable wrench. When I pushed down really hard it made kind of crunching noise, or what I can only assume was the cassette 'ratcheting' on tighter & tighter.

Can anyone offer any advice as to what's goin on here?

Cheers

Si

[DaveM]

Pictures would help, but it sounds like your freehub broke in half. The "springs/pawls" are inside the freehub so if you saw those, you did more than just take the freehub off the hub. Undoing the lockring on the cassette should not have any effect on the freehub. I suspect the internal lockring that holds the freehub together either broke or came loose somehow. It would explain why the whole assembly got loose all of a sudden. Perhaps it is just and issue of putting the freehub back together. You would probably need to get the cassette off the exterior part of the freehub. You will need both the lockring tool and a chainwhip to do that though. (if you can undo a lockring just by holding the cassette with a rag, the lockring is WAY too loose.)

Freehubs are pretty easy to replace, but no one really services them. It's rare they fail...but there you go.

[bobtravers]

X2 for broken freehub... You cannot see the pawls and springs just by removing the freehub from the wheel hub...

[Dalton2250]

(05-24-2011, 08:07 PM)DaveM Wrote:  Pictures would help, but it sounds like your freehub broke in half. The "springs/pawls" are inside the freehub so if you saw those, you did more than just take the freehub off the hub. Undoing the lockring on the cassette should not have any effect on the freehub. I suspect the internal lockring that holds the freehub together either broke or came loose somehow. It would explain why the whole assembly got loose all of a sudden. Perhaps it is just and issue of putting the freehub back together. You would probably need to get the cassette off the exterior part of the freehub. You will need both the lockring tool and a chainwhip to do that though. (if you can undo a lockring just by holding the cassette with a rag, the lockring is WAY too loose.)

Freehubs are pretty easy to replace, but no one really services them. It's rare they fail...but there you go.

Oh right, ok Dave thanks for the reply.

A bit strange that something may be broke in there, because now I've put it all back together the cassette is actually more sturdy than when I first discovered it to be wobbly. What would happen if I just left it do you think? Not saying I will, just curious.

I'll get some pictures of the whole situation posted up at some point today when I have time. Maybe someone will spot something obvious, who knows.

Thanks again

[Dalton2250]

(05-24-2011, 10:01 PM)bobtravers Wrote:  X2 for broken freehub... You cannot see the pawls and springs just by removing the freehub from the wheel hub...

Hi bob, forgive me, I'm not sure what the 'X2 for broken freehub' means in what you said!

Bit weird all this, because I searched around the forum & the internet and nobody seems to have had this problem, where the freehub actually comes off with the cassette and stays stuck in there!

Cheers

Si

[DaveM]

(05-25-2011, 05:20 AM)Dalton2250 Wrote:  What would happen if I just left it do you think? Not saying I will, just curious.

Hard to say without looking at it. BUT, I suspect it is still broken and the whole thing is just being held together by the axle. (The bearing races on the axle, the cones, will force the freehub onto the hub.) But it wouldn't really be a strong connection. If this is true, you might be able to hobble along briefly, but sooner or later something else is going to break. Either the axle or the hub. So I would recommend figuring it out asap.

I've never seen a freehub come apart like this, but I've heard of it. Quite rare, but possible. But again, all of this is speculation based on what you describe. good luck!

[Dalton2250]

(05-25-2011, 04:03 PM)DaveM Wrote:  

(05-25-2011, 05:20 AM)Dalton2250 Wrote:  What would happen if I just left it do you think? Not saying I will, just curious.

Hard to say without looking at it. BUT, I suspect it is still broken and the whole thing is just being held together by the axle. (The bearing races on the axle, the cones, will force the freehub onto the hub.) But it wouldn't really be a strong connection. If this is true, you might be able to hobble along briefly, but sooner or later something else is going to break. Either the axle or the hub. So I would recommend figuring it out asap.

I've never seen a freehub come apart like this, but I've heard of it. Quite rare, but possible. But again, all of this is speculation based on what you describe. good luck!

Again Dave, thanks for the reply. I appreciate your input.

I'm due to be paid soon so gonna buy a chain whip and do the cassette removal procedure properly. Who knows, maybe it won't be so bad. The wheels aren't even very old (1 year approx) so it would rather surprise me if anything was broke really as I only commute on my bike at the moment so hardly anything remotely 'off-road' to cause any major damage. Perhaps I'm being naive though.

Is it possible for a freehub to simply seize a little bit inside a cassette do you think?

Sorry I didn't get chance to do any pictures today but I'll get on it tomorrow for sure.

Cheers

Si

[DaveM]

(05-25-2011, 05:32 PM)Dalton2250 Wrote:  Is it possible for a freehub to simply seize a little bit inside a cassette do you think?

Possible - yes, common - no.
FYI that to remove the freehub from the hub you normally take out the axle then put a 10mm allen wrench into the end of the freehub and unscrew a sleeve bolt that holds it on. Removing cassette from freehub takes the cassette tool and a chain whip.

[Dalton2250]

(05-25-2011, 08:04 PM)DaveM Wrote:  

(05-25-2011, 05:32 PM)Dalton2250 Wrote:  Is it possible for a freehub to simply seize a little bit inside a cassette do you think?

Possible - yes, common - no.
FYI that to remove the freehub from the hub you normally take out the axle then put a 10mm allen wrench into the end of the freehub and unscrew a sleeve bolt that holds it on. Removing cassette from freehub takes the cassette tool and a chain whip.

Yeah, I know the method to remove the freehub, but thanks mate.

One more question, when watching tutorials about removal of parts, installations etc, the mechanic always says use a torque wrench to re-tighten everything. That's fine, but how do you re-torque the lockring on a cassette? Is there a special fitting for a torque wrench that will make it fit on a cassette tool?

Thanks

Si